Little help on rods

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tabond
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Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:26 am

First, I'm happy to say I've found a good clean site for photo sharing!! LOL (I'm an old farmer type, to me that's exciting)

These are the rods that I attempted to use in my FZ750 build last winter, & they are too long. I've double checked their actual dimensions against their build sheet, & they are an exact match. Does anyone have OW-01 rods or FZR750 rods that they can check these specs against? There's 8 brand new Carrillo rods wearing a hole in my top storage shelf....


Image[url=https://postimage.org/]
Last edited by tabond on Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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tabond
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:37 am

They're very pretty... LOL

Image

Image


[url=https://postimage.org/]
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Wed Jan 11, 2017 6:20 pm

Sorry, deleted the first image goofing around with the hosting site.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby spook » Fri Jan 13, 2017 4:37 am

What engine are you wanting to use them in? The OW01 and YZF750 Due to much shorter stroke are much shorter than FZR 1000 and the FZR750 and the FZR750 genesis.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:28 am

I have no use for them at all at this juncture. There's (8) brand new Carrillo rods slowly wearing a hole in a shelf because I can't find what they actually fit. The only thing I do know is they fit the FZ750 but are too long. Seems like an enormous waste. They found their way to me because of the label, and the assumption that FZR750 rods would be the same as FZ750. My hope was that if labeled FZR750 they actually meant the OW01 version, but it's not sounding that way. FZR1000 maybe?
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby spook » Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:37 am

How much longer than the FZ750 rods are they?

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:11 pm

4.4mm longer than the stock FZ750
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby sickle44 » Fri Jan 13, 2017 11:42 pm

If they fit the FZR, I sure would like a set.... to replace the stolen set I already had once
Michael
Yes Yes I know, I said, I'm building a project YZF1070, K. Well you mix two kids a WCB appeal, bringing a BMW 850i up to snuff & then some, mix in a little depression and .......

K, Yeah, I know excuses are just like a,holes; everyone's got one
I will be starting some day??.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby spook » Sat Jan 14, 2017 2:03 am

They won't work Michael they are 4 mm longer than any yamaha 5 valve rod. FZ and FZR 1000 rods are 109.5 mm these are 113.5. It's obvious they were either a mistake, or a special order, look who they were made for... Yoshimura. The fact that they have been kicking around unused for so long, probably a mistake.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:39 am

When I was stuck last year I thought about just calling Cometic and having a spacer cut to move the block up. It gets ridiculous around here sometimes... LOL My guess was a mistake too.

I wonder about FJ rod lengths... I'll google that for a bit and put these back in their oil wrap.
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby sickle44 » Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:29 pm

4mm off with a spacer, that'd sure be one helluva sweet stroker motor if you managed to get it all sorted. Helluva lot more displacement as well, wouldn't that be around 1200 cc?
Michael

Yes Yes I know, I said, I'm building a project YZF1070, K. Well you mix two kids a WCB appeal, bringing a BMW 850i up to snuff & then some, mix in a little depression and .......



K, Yeah, I know excuses are just like a,holes; everyone's got one

I will be starting some day??.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby spook » Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:30 pm

No, it won't give you any more displacement, you would just have a 4 mm spacer and engine mounts that wouldn't line up. Plus these are an 18 mm little end.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:36 am

To increase displacement you'd have to move the pin away from the centerline of the crank. Longer rods would simply move the same stroke higher or lower in the barrel, thus the need for the spacer.
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby spook » Sun Jan 15, 2017 11:50 pm

tabond wrote:I wonder about FJ rod lengths... I'll google that for a bit and put these back in their oil wrap.


Here is something I have been thinking about. (have a look at the spec sheet) for the FZR1000, Genesis or Exup. 01 R1 rods combined with 04 77mm 04 pistons = 1040 kit for our engines. You can buy a set of chinese carrillos for 500 au, and a set of JE standard bore pistons for probably 550 US. I'm yet to check, but I think it may be a goer! I'll let you know :thumbup:

Just for interest's sake the fzr1000-FZ are unique:

Image

tabond wrote:To increase displacement you'd have to move the pin away from the centerline of the crank. Longer rods would simply move the same stroke higher or lower in the barrel, thus the need for the spacer.


Hence the term stroker crank. If you say move the crankshaft big end out 2mm, you increase stroke by 4mm, (because it is measured from the bottom of stroke to the top) 2mm at bottom 2mm at top so you would need a 2mm spacer, for a 4mm stroke advantage. Simple :crazy:

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Mon Jan 16, 2017 6:35 am

Interesting! We were just talking about that over here as one of the vintage clubs in New Hampshire has added an Open class to our P4 1040 is legal.

If I'm reading the chart correctly you'd have to shave the 04R1 interior piston pin bosses on the mill to fit the 01R1 rods. Past that surface grind the jugs the .004 difference and you're back to stock compression, maybe a touch better assuming upgraded R1 piston shape.

And the R1 Pistons are LIGHT!
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby spook » Mon Jan 16, 2017 7:17 am

I'm speculating the 01 rod paired with the 04 standard 77mm piston will drop straight in (after rebore of course). I've got 01 oem rods here just need to purchase an 04 piston to confirm. I don't think any major mods will be required. There is always a lot of freeplay rod to piston so I don't reckon there would be anything to do?

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/111664852988 ... 1436.l2649

By all accounts, there is nothing wrong with these rods.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby tabond » Mon Jan 16, 2017 9:31 am

Well really I guess I'm wondering why stock 01R1 rods wouldn't be up to the task. Essentially you're just making a long stroke 01R1. It'll make around 160hp on the high side and that's only 10
over what the stock rods were built to handle. I suppose the added stress of the longer stroke could add up, but as a budget racer I think you could try stock 01 rods and stock 04 pistons and just give er'! LOL.

I'd say your right I'm sure there's plenty of end play on the wrist pin to allow for the needed .084" I think it's a workable theory anyway!
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Re: Little help on rods

Postby sickle44 » Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:10 pm

Ralph wrote:http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/111664852988 ... 1436.l2649
By all accounts, there is nothing wrong with these rods.


They sure look nice but they are $528Au more than the set I already had. Those look exactly like the carrilos that were stolen. It's proven pretty to find the wiseco 1070's though. I can find them but not for the same $ I paid the first time. I would consider getting the 1040JE's but I've still got the 1070 sleeves. I think the hardest thing to find will be the oversized middle valve. True there's debate between doing the two outside ones instead of the middle one but doing the middle one will be cheaper.
Michael

Yes Yes I know, I said, I'm building a project YZF1070, K. Well you mix two kids a WCB appeal, bringing a BMW 850i up to snuff & then some, mix in a little depression and .......



K, Yeah, I know excuses are just like a,holes; everyone's got one

I will be starting some day??.

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby spook » Fri Jan 27, 2017 1:03 am

sickle44 wrote:It's proven pretty to find the wiseco 1070's though.
.

Wiseco doesn't stock them any more, but they will do a batch of them that you would have to buy. JE would probably make you a set. If you are going to build engines you have to expect to spend money. Personally I think 1040 is big enough, and eliminates the hassle of head gasket problems.

Thanks to Tabond also. We did a deal on the rods and they are headed my way :crazy:

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Re: Little help on rods

Postby sickle44 » Fri Jan 27, 2017 10:37 am

I don't expect to build it for free Ralph, that's for sure. It's just a bit sore having to pay for everything twice. I'll stick with the 1070 bore, just because I've already got the jugs to match, thankfully that and the falicon crank survived the theft. As far as I understood, the head gasket issues came when trying to reach a displacement above 1100.
Michael

Yes Yes I know, I said, I'm building a project YZF1070, K. Well you mix two kids a WCB appeal, bringing a BMW 850i up to snuff & then some, mix in a little depression and .......



K, Yeah, I know excuses are just like a,holes; everyone's got one

I will be starting some day??.


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